Demipharaoh Debates/2012 05 16

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Election 5 Archipelago, Chet, JosS, Philadelphia - May 2012

Demi-Pharaoh results from 202 voters:

F: Chet (43.57)
F:Philadelphia (42.13)
M:JosS (32.59)
M:Archipelago (17.90)

May 13, 2012 Debate #1 Chet & JosS

Dreasimy: Welcome to the 1st Debate in the 5th Election for Demi-Pharaoh of the 6th Tale of ATITD! For the duration of the debate normal Worship Station posts will be halted (you can use L2PBS for this purpose during this period) and only debate-appropriate posts will be let through. Our candidates for this debate are Chet & JosS!

Dreasimy: For those who have never had the opportunity to interact with you before can you share a little about yourself, what you enjoy about ATITD as well as how long you’ve been playing?

Dreasimy: you've* :)

Chet: Greetings fellow Egyptians,for any that missed my last 2 times at bat: I have been playing ATITD since T2, off and on, including the ill fated Bastet. There are lot of things I enjoy about this game, and a lot that drive me crazy (like dark night) but what keeps me playing is the community. It reminds me of family in many ways, fight and argue then work together to get things done.

JosS: I have been playing since mid Tale 2, settled down in Sinai, always stayed there. What I most enjoy is the friendship I have experienced over the years with the people of Egypt. It is always good to be here

Dreasimy: If you win this election you will pass the test of the Demi-Pharaoh and be our 5th DP of this tale. There are a variety of points of view on what the role of DP should and shouldn't be, what is yours?

Chet: If this sounded canned, it is. 3rd debate still haven't a better answer.

Chet: With much power there comes much responsibility. The ban stick is an awesome power, real people are on their keyboards behind our little avatars and many take this game very seriously it is therefore important that DP's take it seriously and use that power with as much care and wisdom as possible. Obvious cases like Geodude don't happen often, most disagreements here are more error than malice and things can be worked out, I see it as a duty of the DP to try that first.(and perhaps second and third)

JosS: I think a DP can help people find the joy of the game back, whenever they might have lost that. Listening to their worries, helping them out with any disputes or troubles they might have. And....if necessairy, use the ban with the most prudence, but use it if needed

Dreasimy: How would you handle it, as DP, if you were involved in an interpersonal conflict with another player?

Chet: If I am involved in a problem I should (and will) recuse myself and request another DP to handle things.

JosS: I think most problems occur because we only can interact in writing. Words are so easy misread, so it is always good to try to get the words right. Did the other person really mean what I read? Talking to eachother, seeying eachother makes interaction so much easier, but is not always possible.

Dreasimy: How would you handle it if a close personal friend or guildmate made a complaint, or had a complaint made against, seeking your intervention as DP and possibly a ban?

Chet: Like being involved myself I should, and would, recuse myself. However in this case I would offer the handling DP(s) whatever insight I could about my 'friend'.

JosS: Not different from what I wrote before...try to get the words right, to let people refrase their words and again, to be sure that all is sayd the right way. Listen to both parties, try to let them speak with eachoter carefully. Its best when the anger could be left out, so a cooling-down period would also help

Dreasimy: So, would it be fair to say JosS that even if you were personally involved or one of your good friends were involved in a situation elevated to DP intervention, you would continue to participate in the situation and not recuse yourself as Chet would?

JosS: I mis-understood the question then...sorry. When I am personally involved in the dispute myslef, or a good and dear friend, I would not try to solve the matter myself ofcourse, beiing to close in that case

Dreasimy: Ok let's move on to the AGA!

Dreasimy: Under what circumstances would you consider utilizing the tools created by the Anti-Griefer's Act (AGA) law? In other words, what do you consider 'griefing'? Do you feel it has been used well so far?

Chet: The AGA should be used,imo, when the issues include 'cleaning up messes' left by a griefer, or if the griefer is particuarly good at evasion. In general tho it seems a way for the DP to avoid responsibility for thier actions and I wouldn't use it unless the other circumstances are met.

JosS: When a person keeps acting in a way that other people cant play anymore, or lose their joy and fun, like Geodude did in the recent past, I call that griefing. Whenever it is physically impossible to use the ban-stick, I think a law could help, but only as a last resort. I agree with Chet that it can never be used to avoid responsibility

Dreasimy: If a person were submitted as a griefer under the AGA, and egypt voted AGAINST banning them, but you still felt they should be banned, would you? What if the general consensus of the rest of the DPs were that that person should not be banned, but you felt strongly that they should? Do you intend to make decisions unilaterally, or in concert with your fellow DPs?

JosS: I dont think that would be wise. A DP is not a dictator and should always listen to other DP s and the people

Chet: If Egypt decides via a vote that a person is not be banned I would not consider overriding it. I do think some discussion among DPs is useful and improtant. But the one that does the deed takes responsibility.

Dreasimy: Let's take a call from a listener! Caller, go ahead:

Dreasimy: GHawkins: A question for the candidates. "What are the qualities that would be good for a DP to possess, but wouldn't necesserily help them to win a popularity contest as the DP election is often portrayed as? How do you possess these qualities?"

Chet: I think being a better listener than talker would be number 1, and obviously from these debates we seem to like talkers in Egypt.

Chet: I think I probably talk too much. :)

JosS: A DP should be a good listener and a person who isnt afraid to take responsibility to act. But formost I think a good DP is a good mentor, helping, whenever and wherever he can. I rl I do these things on a daily basis, working as a team manager at a school (filled with teenagers!)

Dreasimy: Here's another caller!

Hanid: If a majority of DPs agreed to ban a person in your guild who went into hiding, and you bumped into this indvidual would you use your ban ability?

Chet: Yes

JosS: I dont think such a person could stay n my guild, but I would use the ban, yes

Dreasimy: Here's another caller, who has disguised their voice!

Dreasimy: Anonymous: Do you have any issues with people voting/not voting for you because you come from a certian country or speak a certian language or are perceived as a certain gender?

Chet: I hope people don't vote that way. Fortunately we do have secret ballot and people should vote as they see fit. But please do vote.

JosS: I am not against any positive discrimination, as long as this is not the only reason for the vote. But really, people should not use their votes that way.

Dreasimy: Does anyone have access to login to your account? (ie, would any person other than yourself ever have access to your ban powers)? Note: spouselog does not allow access to ban powers.

Chet: no

JosS: no, I changed my password a few days ago to avoid this

Dreasimy: DPs notoriously catch DP disease after becoming DP, disappearing for long periods at a time... it's very mysterious, what do you think causes this condition? Do you feel you are immune? How so?

JosS: I like this place way to much to leave - dont worry

Chet: I have no clue the cause of it, I pray I shall not sucumb. (but for summer I expect a few less hours here and more in my garden)

Dreasimy: Have you played ATITD under other names in this tale or past ones, and if so, what were the names you played under?

JosS: I always used this name, except when I was playing on Bastet: I was Doc there

Chet: Yes, and frankly I don't recall exactly. I generally have a mule with a different name (Chip this tale)

Dreasimy: How many hours a week on average would you say you play ATITD?

Chet: about 30, but a fair amount of that is afk because I am doing other work on the computer.

JosS: that would be between 2 and 5 hrs on a daily basis, a bit more in the weekends

Dreasimy: We have another caller! Caller you are on the line!

Dreasimy: Gyges: DP question: To what extent do you feel it is your obligation as a DP to be involved in disputes? Will you proactively seek out disputes (e.g. by becoming involved in a dispute occurring in guild or regional chat), or will you only involve yourself if you are asked by a participant to provide arbitration, advice, etc.?

JosS: I am not the person to wait till things come to me, so if I have a chance to intervene when I see something happening I would offer my help

Chet: I think one should not stick their nose in uninvited, unless the dispute is spilling over into things like regional chat and causing distress to others.

Dreasimy: Under what types of circumstances do you believe DP’s should use permanent bans? If you are versed in ATITD lore, feel free to give an example from a previous tale where you agreed or disagreed with a ban, if you can’t give examples from the past feel free to just discuss the merits of certain situations (hypothetical or otherwise) over others.

Dreasimy: those little squares are supposed to be apostrophes sorry :)

Chet: I don't think I have enough 'lore' to comment on past, only gossip and rumore. Gossip and rumor should be avoided = especially by DPs.

JosS: I remember a case in T2 (maybe T3) when a couple got married (too soon, as we learned afterwards) and the guy destroyd everything the girl had. He was way out of line there and his ban was a good thing, although the girl was to blame to marry a guy she didnt know well enough.

Chet: Geodude comes to mind as well deserving of permanent ban - on sight. And there was a guy one tale, forget the name, who was always jumping into vigils ...a ban would have been goos there.

Dreasimy: What is your opinion on the use of bonfires to 'claim' clay patches, sometimes weeks before the raeli tech even opens? What is your opinion on 'counter bonfiring' to combat this?

Chet: Its part of the game mechanics for a reason, Teppy and others love the drama. I find it annoying cause it causes some lag but thats life.

JosS: It is not my way of playng this game, but there is no law against this. However, it causes many disputes, and a lot of lag indeed

Dreasimy: We have another caller with a disguised voice! Go ahead caller,

Dreasimy: Anonymous: Do you think the process of considering banishment should be transparent to the average Egyptian or should it be done behind closed doors?

JosS: I think it should be transparent.

Chet: oo What a great question. Would be pretty neat if we handed down written judgements, like a court. But airing peoples dirty laundry would in the end just add to the problems so keeping it private seems wise.

Dreasimy: What have you done, or what do you plan to do, to benefit Egypt as a whole?

Chet: I pitch in where I can, mentor new folks a lot and try to stay outta trouble.

JosS: I will continue doing what I do now: to help and mentor people

Dreasimy: What distinguishes you as a DP candidate from the rest?

Chet: A record for most runs this tale? Seriously we generally get good qualified people to this round and think any of them would make fine DPs.

JosS: I dont think that is for me to say - I highly respect the other candidates and this question should be ansered by the people, not by the candidates

Dreasimy: Do you feel there should be a limit on how many avatars one person can run? How do you feel about players who run alt armies that macro constantly?

Chet: I think we need better controls on AFK macroing. The alt armies do give people an advantage but as long as they don't afk macro - they are paying for the privilge.

JosS: There is no law against having a lot of avatars. As long as people keep themselves to the macro rules its ok with me

Dreasimy: We have another caller!

Dreasimy: Anonymous: Who would you vote for if you weren't running this time?

Chet: Can't say until I see the other 'debate'. Silly me wants as much info as possible.

JosS: Sorry, my vote is secret

Chet: oo great answer JosS

Dreasimy: When is the last time you voted for someone to move forward in one of the earlier rounds of DP other than yourself? Can you share who that vote was for and why?

Chet: I make it a personal rule never to vote for myself unless I somehow get stuck trying to break a tie. Atm I can't recall voting for myself. I think I voted for Bryce once :)

Chet: My mule voted for Linsha this last set of rounds, she was only one in channel that tlaked.

JosS: I have never voted for myself. I voted for Chet in the previous election btw :)

Chet: I'll vouch for that :)

Dreasimy: How do you feel about the fact that no one knows who all the GMs are? How do you feel about the fact that players who volunteer for event staff are anonymous?

Chet: Both issues are problematic, but much liek the bonfires an issue for the game designer. Write more petitions!!

JosS: I think we should know who all the GM s are. If that is not hte case (which I dont know for certain) I dont think that is right. In events and/or story it is a different case: people play another role there

Dreasimy: If, during a phoenix race, someone lit a -str incense at CSs and pinned certain racers down with bricks to prevent them from winning, would you consider this griefing, and how would you handle the situation?

Chet: Its within the game mechanics. Not very sportsman like but then neither is over building Obe ... as such its not really my business unless it escalates into personal revenge stuff.

JosS: I hope there is no player that evil - but then: there is no law against it....

Dreasimy: Since real life can affect how people react to things, are you willing to consider RL facts before thinking of banning? If so, how far into a person's personal life are you willing to delve to find out what might be causing their actions?

Chet: Consider, yes. Delve into, no.

JosS: Though you cannot always keep rl out, I think it should not interfere with the game. So I think this player should stop playing untill he or she is fit to resume

Dreasimy: In previous tales we've had laws/features that prevent anonymous use of explosives. How would you handle a situation where you knew someone maliciously destroyed someone's belongings or say, a Chariot Stop. Does the type of item(s) destroyed make a difference in how you feel it should be addressed? If you were DP and the person who used the explosives was a guildmate of yours, what would you do?

Chet: Maliciously blowing stuff up is griefing.

JosS: Ahhh the explosives.... Again, its all in the game, but ofcourse not acceptable, guild mate or not.

Dreasimy: If you have burning questions to ask please get them in soon :D

Dreasimy: We've had some disputes already this tale some over land use (i.e. building in someone else's 'space'). What role do DPs have in these situations, how would you or have you handled these kinds of disputes?

Chet: We all know too well that their is no land ownership here, we simply need to use good sense and manners. Sadly these qualities are often lacking. Chat with the people involved, try to get a mutually acceptable solution going.

JosS: Not different from other disputes: try to get people to act reasonable and find a solution that is acceptable for all involved

Dreasimy: Have you ever authored a petition that has made it to ballot? If so what was the purpose of the petition. Are you carrying any petitions now? If so, what?

Chet: First question: no. Second part - yes, its about use of explosives and suthored by Skyfeather.

JosS: No – no

Dreasimy: Do you want to win this election and become Egypt's 5th DP? If so, why?

Chet: Yes. Geting tired of these debates. I think I can add to the reduction of drama in Egypt/

JosS: Yes I want to win this - otherwise I would be in this election! I am ready to help anyone who needs me

Dreasimy: I'd like each of you to wrap up now and tell Egypt what they will get in a DP by voting for you.

JosS: You get a guy who is willing to listen to you, who is always prepared to help out and teach. I wont let you down.

Chet: No more Chet repeating herself in these debates! A DP who does her best to bring good sense and manners to the table. I hope you all wil get out and vote, way too often we fail to vote then complain about who got elected.

Dreasimy: Ninjas or Pirates? GO!

Chet: Pirates, I like parrots.

JosS: haha me toooo

Dreasimy: Thank you everyone for listening, calling in, and being thoughtful voters! Don't forget to tune in for the 2nd debate 7 hours from now :D

Chet: ANd I am outta here

Dreasimy: Thanks candidates :D

Questions Missed in Chet & JosS' Debate

kuupid: Question: We have a DP wiki page set up by LuluDivine or confrontations so egypt can read leading to a ban. Are you willing to use that wiki page if you become a DP?

• Chet's Response -Yes

• JosS' Response - Yes

Anonymous: As the DP role could be looked as leaders, have you ever took the time after weekly passes to go visit the art or thought puzzles for people who have been in a runner's up listing on passes? if not, why not ?

• Chet's Response -Yes

• JosS' Response - Yes

silver: Philadelpia said earlier the _only_ job of the DP is to be a ban-entrustee, but given that DPs will be in short supply (possibly one of the lowest test-passer supplies in Egypt), aren't they obliged to try to achieve better than student of leadership to help with the monument?

• Chet's Response -Yes

• JosS' Response - Yes

May 13th, 2012 Debate #2 Archipelago & Philadelphia

Dreasimy: Welcome to the 2nd Debate in the 5th Election for Demi-Pharaoh of the 6th Tale of ATITD! For the duration of the debate normal Worship Station posts will be halted (you can use L2PBS for this purpose during this period) and only debate-appropriate posts will be let through. Our candidates for this debate are Archipelago & Philadelphia!

Dreasimy: If you have questions that you would like to submit during the debate, just submit them to Worship Station or via Chat to Dreasimy but please note that comments, discussion, personal attacks, and redundant questions will be tabled or asked to be rephrased. Also, I will do my best to also reframe any candidate-specific questions so that all candidates can answer them (tho your original question will remain in tact for the person you specified.)

Dreasimy: For those who have never had the opportunity to interact with you before can you share a little about yourself, what you enjoy about ATITD as well as how long you’ve been playing?

Philadelphia: I started playing in midstream during T3, which was one of the best tales I played. It was the only non-violent game around at the time, and I still play cuz it is the most intelligent of what is offered out there. I enjoy the people and the interactions. I used to play to level and achieve, nowadays I play to catch up with folk and just enjoy playing around.

Philadelphia: oh, forgot. I have played every tale since...when RL allows me to.

Archipelago:: Hello everyone and thanks :) I have been around since T1. I enjoy playing ATITD because it has one of the best communities I've been apart of, with the most intelligent and best looking virtual citizens. I live in southern 7L and have been here since the beginning of the telling. I enjoy many aspects of the game, from tests to just building things :)

Dreasimy: If you win this election you will pass the test of the Demi-Pharaoh and be our 5th DP of this tale. There are a variety of points of view on what the role of DP should and shouldn't be, what is yours?

Philadelphia: this POV has changed for me over the years. I used to think it was reserved only for high leveling, benevolent, overachievers. And their reward for all their hard work. Nowadays I see it a lot simpler: someone you entrust 7 possible bans too...some you trust to use the bans wisely (or not to use) and be able to determine when it is appropriate.

Archipelago:: I view the role the DP primarily for conflict resolution. Achieving this means they should be able to draw from a host of qualities, like active-listening, consensus building, and critical thinking, which are all leadershp competencies, so in truth DPs really are leaders, but their role specifically is conflict management

Dreasimy: How would you handle it, as DP, if you were involved in an interpersonal conflict with another player?

Philadelphia: Could this be clarified? A conflict I had with another player, or one that I heard/learned about?

Dreasimy: This question is about a conflict you have with another player

Dreasimy: Hypothetically of course :D

Philadelphia: ty

Philadelphia: naturally!

Archipelago:: I would handle an interpersonal conflict with another player the same way I would if I were not DP. First, I would want to understand where the disconnect exists between us and see if that gap could be closed some how. I think most conflicts can be resolved by simply understanding the other's position and finding common ground. Leveraging DP powers for personal gain would be pretty tacky :)

Archipelago:: Moreover, conflicts are often viewed negatively. I think interpersonal conflicts are really opportunites to grow and learn that should taken as is. Skewing them by knee-jerk reaction back by DP authority is creating missed opportunities.

Archipelago:: Some of my best friends ig are people that I have not always seen eye-to-eye with. But we worked to overcome the obstacles and have mutually grown from it.

Philadelphia: whenever things get too close I have always sought outside opinions and 'help'. There have been some occasions where my style of play or personality was in conflict with anothers. I talk it out with others to get a reality check because I am not always in the right, (can you believe that?) and am willing to suck it up and move on. Using a DP ban to 'resolve' said conflict would never happen for me--just not my style. .

Dreasimy: How would you handle it if a close personal friend or guildmate made a complaint, or had a complaint made against, seeking your intervention as DP and possibly a ban?

Philadelphia: As with any others I would seriously look into the complaint, and do a reality check as of course I may be biased. I have a high opinion of my guildies, but sometimes even in the best of times......

Archipelago:: First, regardless of my relationship I would look into the issue with the same alacrity. I look into the different perspectives, gather information, and if the guildie was found to be the source of the disturbance, I would seek to resolve the issue through whatever means is determined appropriate

Archipelago:: I am not above using tickle torture or wet noodles to discern the truth

Archipelago:: and I am not a big fan of nepotism :)

Dreasimy: Under what circumstances would you consider utilizing the tools created by the Anti-Griefer's Act (AGA) law? In other words, what do you consider 'griefing'? Do you feel it has been used well so far?

Philadelphia: i love this new tool! Wish we had it in previous tales. It's a good feel for if someone has been more than just a passing pain.

Philadelphia: it has been used very well so far. I believe kuupid used it to help get rid of several little obnoxious miscreants.

Philadelphia: I would initiate the AGA after hearing and witnessing about an individual player or group of players causing conflict on another's game play.

Archipelago:: I can tell you with certainty the AGA was used appropriately with respect to Geodude, as he built his camp in the middle of mine. I think it should be used primarly for griefing individuals who are particularly evasive, and is another great tool the community can exercise to keep the peace

Archipelago:: As an aside, I want to give a shout out to kuupid for going above and beyond to resolve the Geodude issue.

Archipelago:: and several others that supported her in her efforts :)

Dreasimy: If a person were submitted as a griefer under the AGA, and egypt voted AGAINST banning them, but you still felt they should be banned, would you? What if the general consensus of the rest of the DPs were that that person should not be banned, but you felt strongly that they should? Do you intend to make decisions unilaterally, or in concert with your fellow DPs?

Philadelphia: she also attempted it with Teppy, but it didn't work...yet. :P

Philadelphia: if this were the case, I would have to begin to believe that I may be in the wrong, and I would abide by what Egypt and the DPs felt was the correct action. in 95% of the cases I would make decisions with fellow DPs. It allows time to understand the conflict and the person causing the conflict. 5% of the time I would use for someone seriously stalking or abusing another player, and not seeing any resolution to the situation except in the way of a ban.

Archipelago:: As I mentioned earlier, it is imperative DPs strive for concensus and legitamize that consensus with follow-through. Regardless of my personal feelings, I would never consider a renegade ban as an option, because frankly I would not be exercising the will of the community which is voiced by the majority of elected representatives.

Dreasimy: Here's a listener question submitted this morning :D

Dreasimy: GHawkins: A question for the candidates. "What are the qualities that would be good for a DP to possess, but wouldn't necesserily help them to win a popularity contest as the DP election is often portrayed as? How do you possess these qualities?"

Dreasimy: (oops sorry I think I posted this while Archipelago was still answering, if so please forgive your moderator!) :D

Archipelago:: Nope, I was done :) This is a fantastic question btw :)

Dreasimy: phew

Archipelago:: lol

Philadelphia: he was too busy making a balloon animal. :P

Archipelago:: Well linking back to their role as conflict managers, DPs have to rely on many exhibited behaviors or competencies that overlap with the skill sets belonging to leaders....

Archipelago:: And my path through life has led me into many varied leadership roles, in the military, academia, business, and as an occasional guild leader :)

Archipelago:: Ultimately, it's a people business (the business of DP) and being able to synthesize disparate viewpoints is fundamental

Archipelago:: So to answer your question specifically, i think great communication skills, abandoning the "God complex" and seeking the opinions of others to suggest solutions, among many other traits are important for a DP to possess

Philadelphia: DPs need to know and understand all types of personalities and be patient! Getting to know people on opposite sides of a conflict does not win popularity contests, and as had happened to me, can lose your friendships with others.

Philadelphia: Even though this is 'just a game' one needs to have an overwhelming sense of fairness, over favoritism, nepotism or other 'isms'. I let my hair down for this game, but fairness will always be the card I play first.

kuupid: And if a new DP promises to make ballon animals do we get one every day?

Dreasimy: Here's another caller question from this morning:

Dreasimy: Hanid: If a majority of DPs agreed to ban a person in your guild who went into hiding, and you bumped into this indvidual would you use your ban ability?

Archipelago:: I would like to mention I make a mean balloon animal and I look like brad pitt irl

Philadelphia: quit kising the babies, Archie!

kuupid: hey, he can kiss the great grandma's ;)

Archipelago:: kung-fu chops Philadelphia

kuupid: come to me Archie, I'll hug and kiss you all night

Philadelphia: abuse!!!!

Dreasimy: Please put the peanut gallery stuff (which is great!) on L2PBS if at all possible, thank you :D

Archipelago:: That is another good question, but the short answer is yes. If consensus was gained, even if i was dissenting, i would ban that individual

Philadelphia: Could I assume with that question that I had been given information about the proposed ban prior?

Dreasimy: Yes I think the question is assuming you know the other DPs agreed to ban this person if they found them

Archipelago:: Yea, that is under the assumption, I was involved in that decision

Philadelphia: and all the information surrounding the ban....

Dreasimy: Ya it is hypothetical but I think the other candidates have all interpreted it as you have the info about why they all believe the ban is warranted and that they have agreed to do so if they find them :)

Philadelphia: It's been decided and debated, then it's time to move on to the execution, which in this case seriously needs to be done at that moment, as this charater has been hiding out and no one else has pegged him/her.

Dreasimy: New question coming in!

kuupid: Question: We have a DP wiki page set up by LuluDivine or confrontations so egypt can read leading to a ban. Are you willing to use that wiki page if you become a DP?

Philadelphia: of course! another tool to use. yes yes yes!

Dreasimy: This is similar to a question the morning candidates had which I am going to throw in here now since it is topical to this subject:

Dreasimy: Anonymous: Do you think the process of considering banishment should be transparent to the average Egyptian or should it be done behind closed doors?

Archipelago:: It's critical to use all information possible from as many perspectives as possible to be able to frame a situation in 3 dimensions. To not use such a resource would draw into question the reason for ever running for DP in the first place.

Archipelago:: From a practical standpoint, discussing an issue in a small group is important because the discussion is more readily focused than it would be with a few hundred people. But the content of that discussion should absolutley be transparent.

Archipelago:: Transparency is integral in any elected position, or at least should be

Philadelphia: hmmm. tough question. I believe initially behind closed doors, as there may be some logistics to discuss without that person being in the know, case in point being Geodude. But I believe after the decision if folk wish to know how the decision was made, they should be given that information.

Dreasimy: Here's a listener from this morning, their voice has been altered to protect their identity!

Dreasimy: Anonymous: Do you have any issues with people voting/not voting for you because you come from a certian country or speak a certian language or are perceived as a certain gender?

Archipelago:: People are people, and regardless of how someone arrived at their decision with respect to their choice for DP, I would certainly not take issue with them. I have long ago abandoned the pursuit of changing people, you truly only have the power to effect your own decision.

Archipelago:: I respect everyone's decision in this matter, but I certainly relish the opportunity to engage those I've had little/no contact with. :)

Archipelago:: That is another very good question anonymous :)

Philadelphia: I have no issues with that. And there are some legitimate reasons behind that. If I was 1 out of 5 english players in this game, it would probably be very nice to have a DP who could speak english with me. Even same country. They have their reasons. Gender? well, who knows what genders we REALLY are....

Dreasimy: Does anyone have access to login to your account? (ie, would any person other than yourself ever have access to your ban powers)? Note: spouselog does not allow access to ban powers.

Archipelago:: Absolutely not. I have four active accounts, and only I have the wield them!

Philadelphia: nope. no one has EVER logged into my account since T3 (not including spouselog)

Dreasimy: DPs notoriously catch DP disease after becoming DP, disappearing for long periods at a time... it's very mysterious, what do you think causes this condition? Do you feel you are immune? How so?

Archipelago:: My diagnosis is that it can certainly be stress related, because of the time committment and maybe because the DP mountain has been climbed and there is nothing else on the horizon for those individuals

Archipelago:: No one is immune to this, it could be a variety of other reasons too....family issues, work-related, etc...who knows really

Archipelago:: as for my immunity, i can say with a high level of certainty I am not going anywhere and even though I'm the only one left in my guild (I've been alone for the last 2 months) I'm having the most fun ig since T1

Archipelago:: I look forward to logging on everyday, talking to my friends, creating, and generally getting the most out of my experience here

Archipelago:: I have been blessed in a lot of areas of my life, and I certainly count this world as one of those areas

Archipelago:: So as far as my longevity is concerned, I've been here since T1 and I don't plan on that changing :)

Philadelphia: I've seen that happen and I was rather frustrated with it. RL does and will happen to all of us. I do plan on seeing this tale to the end however; it's a great place to relieve stress and it's helped me in between studying and dealing with my famdamily issues. So you will not get rid of me anytime soon.

Dreasimy: Have you played ATITD under other names in this tale or past ones, and if so, what were the names you played under?

Philadelphia: famdamily was NOT a typo btw.

Archipelago:: All of the names I've used in this game include: Archipelago, Mailorderbride, Imp, Billymays, Alpha (all current), Arielas, Magicdonjuan (tales past)

Philadelphia: In my newbie days, I got rather frustrated, and having not been mentored, I knew nothing and was going nowhere fast. I started a new character and received mentor and I finally realized the true potential of the game. And I forgot her name....Leela or something. Well, I only played her for maybe a week, then I went back to my original character, Philadelphia, and stayed with this name for 4 tales. I have no mules.

Dreasimy: How many hours a week on average would you say you play ATITD?

Archipelago:: It always depends on balancing real-life committments, but overall, I'd have to say some where in the neighborhood of 40 hours on average

Philadelphia: I play on average about 10-15 hours depending on school and family obligations. This semester was a terror, and I uncommonly only had time during my breaks at work.

Dreasimy: Let's have some listener questions. This first one is a new one, not in this morning's debate

Dreasimy: Anonymous: As the DP role could be looked as leaders, have you ever took the time after weekly passes to go visit the art or thought puzzles for people who have been in a runner's up listing on passes? if not, why not ?

Archipelago:: As a habit, I try to do that whenever I pass someone's puzzle, art, whatever. To me that is part of being an active community member and I have a special affinity for empty hand puzzles :)

Archipelago:: I know I would want someone to certainly do that for me, so I try to do it for others whenever I can

Philadelphia: I don't particularly look at the weekly passes list on a regular basis, but if someone has some artwork out there that is new and I pass by it, I always try to vote, OR if there is a shout out in guild, region or Egypt wide chat, I go out of my way. I got stuck in the boonies one tale and had to PULL teeth to get them to vote on it. So I know how it feels and will help other peeps out.

Dreasimy: Gyges: DP question: To what extent do you feel it is your obligation as a DP to be involved in disputes? Will you proactively seek out disputes (e.g. by becoming involved in a dispute occurring in guild or regional chat), or will you only involve yourself if you are asked by a participant to provide arbitration, advice, etc.?

Archipelago:: If you assume the mantle of DP, no duties should be obligatory. Seeking resolution where you are able and especially when you are asked is an important part of a member of the community.

Archipelago:: I am of the opinion conflicts should always be resolved at the lowest possible level though

Archipelago:: That can often be done by simply reframing the issue and iluminating context

Philadelphia: Relationships with people are why I keep logging into this game---my 'to do' list uncommonly never gets crossed off as I enjoy interacting with folk. Even trying to resolve a problem. BUT it really depends on the dispute and where it occurs.

Philadelphia: One cannot be everywhere all the time. DP is a human occupation, and there are no omnipotent options. Darn that Teppy!

Dreasimy: Under what types of circumstances do you believe DP’s should use permanent bans? If you are versed in ATITD lore, feel free to give an example from a previous tale where you agreed or disagreed with a ban, if you can’t give examples from the past feel free to just discuss the merits of certain situations (hypothetical or otherwise) over others.

Archipelago:: You always have to consider context. As such, each situation should be defined on a case-by-case basis. You have to consider many things when determining if a ban is appropriate. Intent and "common good" are certainly factors that should be considered.

Archipelago:: Geodude is a recent, shining example of when a ban is appropriate.

Archipelago:: He has expressly stated his intent was to bring discontent to others. That was central to him playing the game. His chosen play style adversely effected the enjoyment of a vast majority of players

Archipelago:: A DP ban is appropriate in such an egregious case of griefing, but only after consensus has been gained

Philadelphia: correct usage of permanet ban: Darius III and Geodue, both consistent pests and outright interfering with others game play.

Philadelphia: inappropriate usage of permanent ban: banning someone you dislike or had a feud with, an example which took place in T6.

Philadelphia: Those are examples, NOT the rules, as we've had quite a bunch of interesting characters in this game, that one could scratch their heads on, such as Richter in T3 and T6 (under another name) and the Nigerian Businessmen. They were rude and obnoxious and oftentimes DID interfere with others game play.

Philadelphia: sorry, inappropriate ban in T5, not T6

Dreasimy: What is your opinion on the use of bonfires to 'claim' clay patches, sometimes weeks before the raeli tech even opens? What is your opinion on 'counter bonfiring' to combat this?

Archipelago:: I think bonfiring a clay patch that may lay within your camp as a preventive measure is acceptable, but generally speaking, I think bonfiring clay to begin with outside of your camp is basically lame.

Archipelago:: Is it bannable? No, but in my opinion is a little bit silly. Some people are of a different mindset which I respect though, but I would not do it myself, because really....there are an aweful lot of clay patches if you look for them.

Archipelago:: That is arguble though :)

Philadelphia: it's one of those game overlooks that should have been better addressed by retooling the test and the creation of ovens.

Philadelphia: it's a part of the game now; i personally would not do it, but know of others who have. and have been doing it since T3

Philadelphia: counter bonfiring means that there is an additional need for a finite resource, and that someone is upset. Could be a great opportunity to address the dispute and the needs of both parties.

Philadelphia: Not a bannable offense on either party.

Dreasimy: What have you done, or what do you plan to do, to benefit Egypt as a whole?

Archipelago:: I simply do what I do. I am not really defined by a cause or a specific interest, but I certainly try to help wherever I can. This is often on an individual basis if someone is in need of something I can provide, be it a service or product. I am currently working on something that will benefit a great deal of people I think :

Archipelago:: :)

Archipelago:: I have worked on a variety of things in the past and I will work on many more in the coming months and hopefully years

Philadelphia: making playing this game more enjoyable! I have assisted Egypt (L2PBS) mods for two tales, set up and maintain the HIVE this tale (active member in previous tales) and also Teller at the Goods. I do this because it promotes community and makes playing that much more fun. I also try to attend the out of the way weddings, teach bellydancing to underprivileged women (sorry men, 1,000 lessons is a commitment, and only Tig gets those!).

Dreasimy: What distinguishes you as a DP candidate from the rest?

Archipelago:: While we all have a variety of experiences and qualities that make us unique, I would like to think I have a special knack for working with people towards a common goal. As I previously mentioned, I've done this in many facets of my life, including here in Egypt. I love working in teams and helping develop people. That to me is more than just a quality, it is a passion.

Archipelago:: That passion can create strong opinions sometimes, but it certainly defines who I am both here and in real life.

Archipelago:: I am always of the belief that if everyone is thinking alike, someone is not thinking also. Thinking without convention of thought is definitely something I hold dear, because it can highlight features that my go otherwise unnoticed.

Archipelago:: may*

Philadelphia: I think we all could bring our unique talents to the position and every single candidate would be a boon. But what distinguishes (a much larger word than I would use, but let's roll with it) me....

Philadelphia: making sure that this game I play actually gives me enjoyment, along with the others I am playing with. Each time I log here, I inevitably try to make a joke, or make someone smile.

Philadelphia: Personal time for me often gets blurred...I put people and their needs before mine and why I never level nor build anything much worthwhile. lol!

Philadelphia: Some people may think it's because I am not serious enough or lack drive. Total opposite.

Philadelphia: So that's what I bring to the table: serious about making this game enjoyable and the drive to do it.

Dreasimy: Do you feel there should be a limit on how many avatars one person can run? How do you feel about players who run alt armies that macro constantly?

Archipelago:: That all depends on perspective. Some people enjoy developing multiple accounts, some one. Resources are always a factor, but if someone is able and willing to spend their own money to play a game they love, the way they love/choose, who could or should tell them no? Not me.

Archipelago:: There are positivies and negatives that can be cited here, but to say someone having 2,3,10 alts is a bad thing or a good thing is beyond me. Like many other features of this game, and life, it just is.

Philadelphia: I asked back in T3 why were not allowed to have two avatars for the price of one, like in WoW and was told about how we can pursue multiple tests and disciplines...etc etc... bullox, but it's Teppy's game. As far as multiple avatars...wow. I don't know how they do it, but go for it. As long as these multiple/tribal accounts are not abused, such as creating these accounts to win the Test of mentor...etc. Then that's kinda low.

Philadelphia: i've known both types of people and the truly wonderful kuupid does amazing things with her alts..

Dreasimy: Anonymous: Who would you vote for if you weren't running this time?

Philadelphia: i've worked only semi-formally with JosS, Archi, and Chet over the tales, and shared guilds with all of them.

Philadelphia: They are all wonderful peeps and it would be a tough decision.

Philadelphia: If FORCED to (Dreasimy is making me) I guess Archipelago because he's a great sport and gives me guff back.

Archipelago:: I'm not going to avoid this question. Of course you should always wait for the DP debates to conclude to come to a conclusion, but if I HAD to make a decision that did not include myself, I would pick Philadelphia. This is based on my past experiences and general knowledge. Although, I like all candidates and all are certainly qualified for the job :)

Archipelago:: and that's also not because Philadelphia has threatened me with physical violence if I didn't vote for her :)

Dreasimy: How do you feel about the fact that no one knows who all the GMs are? How do you feel about the fact that players who volunteer for event staff are anonymous?

Archipelago:: As an aside, if I could pick ANYONE to be DP, I would pick Rabble.

Philadelphia: wow, so it's not just me that doesn't know them all? I know the ones who are vocal and who have assisted me (out of a dreaded unnavigable, but still got me stuck, pool of water). I socialized with two in particular but there are more? Not sure if putting their names on the wiki would be beneficial as I see what happens whenever someone mentions an issue and a GM steps in to help in a chat and then is inundated with others questions.

Philadelphia: Volunteers (i am assuming they wish to be anonymous) should remain anonymous if that is what they choose. I would dislike the fact that they are stalked by someone who felt cheated out of a prize or reward. How uncool is that?

Philadelphia: volunteer event staff that is

Archipelago:: I am really indifferent towards this. In a perfect world, GMs and event staff would not be players, but given the parameter within which this game operates, GMs maintaining a low-profile and staff remaining anonymous is most favorable

Dreasimy: (I think I am going to start posting responses in order regardless of who the answer comes from to save some time (potentially). this means that they won't all be clumped together as they have been but you'll all figure it out :D

Archipelago:: I know those are tough jobs, and I applaude anyone for taking the time to enrich the community

Dreasimy: This is from a listener in response to an earlier answer from Philadelphia

silver: Philadelpia said earlier the _only_ job of the DP is to be a ban-entrustee, but given that DPs will be in short supply (possibly one of the lowest test-passer supplies in Egypt), aren't they obliged to try to achieve better than student of leadership to help with the monument?

Philadelphia: Monuments require DPs?

Philadelphia: Oracles are needed, not DPs.

Dreasimy: They require oracles which mean they have to have passed DP

Philadelphia: for only one monument, not necessarily them all.

Philadelphia: it would be sad if that was the only reason to give someone a ban stick.... :(

Archipelago:: Leadership comes in many forms, sometimes formalized in tests, sometimes taking the initiative to help others. Raising monuments helps the community and is a consideration

silver: they require oracles who have to have passed dp, several sages who have passed 6 tests (one might not be dp, but covered cartouche passes will also be rare), even more masters (all but 2 tests)... etc. it's certainly easier to fill the top spots if we don't have the rare test passes (dp and cartouche) at the bottom

Philadelphia: point silver.

silver: it wouldn't be a reason to make someone dp: but failing ambition might be a reason _not_ to make one dp.

Archipelago:: That is certainly true, and should factor into the decision. With that in mind it is should be encouraged for elected DPs to pursue that line

Sabina: not just encouraged but assisted too

Dreasimy: Thank you Sabina, let's keep this channel for questions though, discussion is better served in L2PBS at the moment :D

Archipelago:: encouraged through action :)

Dreasimy: We have to start wrapping up very soon due to scheduling

Philadelphia: yes, silver that is true, but know that i do not lack ambition. priorities are for people first, and perhaps putting up a monument might become the priority.

Philadelphia: for me that is.

Dreasimy: Since real life can affect how people react to things, are you willing to consider RL facts before thinking of banning? If so, how far into a person's personal life are you willing to delve to find out what might be causing their actions?

Archipelago:: Banning is not a small matter. This is a game, but people make a huge time, monetary, emotional investment to play this game. You should always seek to paint a full picture as DP by gathering the most information possible about the situation/parties involved in a potential ban

Archipelago:: Real life plays into this, but I also respect individual privacy. So if information is offered, or gained through elicitation, it should certainly be used in that decision

Philadelphia: RL facts do affect people's game play, however there should be no circumstances that would make you a griefer to another player. In T3 Darius III argued it was his game playing WoW that made him so rude and mean.

Archipelago:: I would not probe someone to the point of being offensive, however, if I felt I was approaching those bounds

Philadelphia: Stress in game may also affect others; it's usually temporary and is easily resolved-for most people. It should be handled case by case and an in depth psycho therapy session should not be necessary nor encouraged.

Dreasimy: Since we've run out of time, the rest of the questions not covered will be put on the wiki page of the debate log for the candidates to answer. Ifyou have time before you log out, I'd like each of you to wrap up now and tell Egypt what they will get in a DP by voting for you.

Archipelago:: DPs, like any elected official, is a steward of the trust of their constituency. I have a deep appreciation for the community and the things we do here, and I would never do anything to violate that trust. Moreover, I would continue to do what I do in terms of trying to make the collective experience here better.

Archipelago:: I want to ensure everyone continues enjoying that experience, and that is what your vote will do if it is passed my way :)

Philadelphia: As I do now, I would hope that me being in the role of DP would assist others in making their game play enjoyable and worth playing.

Dreasimy: Thank you candidates :D We are done for now. I will post the link to the debate logs in an easy to chew format soon as well as the questions the 2 groups of candidates didn't have a chance to answer. :D Thanks for listening and thoughtfully voting, Egypt :D

Archipelago:: Thanks everyone and please consider my nomination for Demi-pharaoh :) Thanks a bunch Dreasimy!

Questions Missed in Archipelago & Philadelphia's Debate

If, during a phoenix race, someone lit a -str incense at CSs and pinned certain racers down with bricks to prevent them from winning, would you consider this griefing, and how would you handle the situation?

• Archipelago's Answer - I would definitely consider this griefing. I would immediately contact the person engaging in this activity and ask them to stop. If they failed to do so, I would escalate the issue through the appropriate channels until a positive resolution was reached.

• Philadelphia's Answer - The incense at the CS along with the 'gift' of bricks is griefing. This is in no way fair 'game parameters'. If confronted with this situation I would ask that the players remove the incense and refrain from further brick distribution. I would also ask that these players be disqualified (and all prizes taken away if it got that far) from the event, contacting a GM or even Teppy...I hear he does answer his phone.

In previous tales we've had laws/features that prevent anonymous use of explosives. How would you handle a situation where you knew someone maliciously destroyed someone's belongings or say, a Chariot Stop. Does the type of item(s) destroyed make a difference in how you feel it should be addressed? If you were DP and the person who used the explosives was a guildmate of yours, what would you do?

• Archipelago's Answer - This is a situation where I would want to gather as much information as possible because of the severity of the offense. If it was determined malice was involved, this would certainly fall under the category of bannable offense. I would definitely consider the overall context of the event, to include item destroyed, but if the item were something like a chariot stop it would be highly likely the person's intent was not good. I would treat this situation the same regardless of who committed the offense.

• Philadelphia's Answer -The use of explosives to damage someone else's property is in my opinion a bannable offense. There is only one reason why you would blow it up and that would be to grief, unless it was by accident, but they would have to come up with a really good case for that. That would be a situation in which I would discuss it with the offender, the victim and with the other DPs and come up with a decision to ban or not. If it was a guildmate, I would discuss it with the same parties, but I would asked to be relieved from the banning voting to avoid a conflict of interest. If all DPs were absent for an extended amount of time and I was the only DP, and if there was really no good reasoning behind the blow up I would ban my guildmate.

We've had some disputes already this tale some over land use (i.e. building in someone elses 'space'). What role do DPs have in these situations, how would you or have you handled these kinds of disputes?

• Archipelago's Answer - I would definitely assist in this sort of situation to diffuse tempers and to find a positive resolution where possible. In my experience, circumstances like this can usually be resolved through mediated talks and I would certainly help where I could in reframing the issue so both sides could worth through it. Again, context is important here, and if the perceived incursion was obviously to press the buttons of other player(s), I would work to resolve the problem through measured escalation.

• Philadelphia's Answer -I've relied on DPs in the past to assist in land use disputes as great conflict resolvers. Most importantly great listeners. IN most cases they were successful. I believe this is a good role for the DPs to play , because of their status in Egypt. A few tales back I became involved in a dispute regarding the use of guild materials. Both parties could not agree and became rather angry at each other. It took a lot of listening and patience on my part between the two of them and it ended in a doable compromise. The parties no longer talk to each other, but I have rather gotten fond of each of them. Lots of listening skills are necessary. :D

Have you ever authored a petition that has made it to ballot? If so what was the purpose of the petition. Are you carrying any petitions now? If so, what?

• Archipelago's Answer - I have authored several ballots in the past, but I have yet to author one this telling that has made it to the ballot. I do actively seek out ballots others carry and gather signatures whenever I can. This telling I have carried several ballots for others, like one used for minimap improvement.

• Philadelphia's Answer -Several of mine in prior tales received Physics vetoes. This tale I had a petition to allow the L2PBS Microphone to be picked up from anywhere, and not just in one, physical, location. Petition was turned in with 106 signatures and legal opinion currently is: feature. I also heard rumors that this was going to be implemented....but.....(shrugs)

Do you want to win this election and become Egypt's 5th DP? If so, why?

• Archipelago's Answer - I absolutely want to win this election because I believe I would do the job well. I am consistent, independently-minded while still having a deep appreciation for the community, and I have the skill set required for the position. I am decisive, but I actively seek the advice of others when I can because I know the viewpoint of an individual is usually limited. Also, I have been around since T1 and I have no plans to leave Egypt regardless of what happens!

• Philadelphia's Answer -Yes, i want to win this election, not for fame or fortune and not just to gain a level.I want to win so I can continue to serve Egypt in additional capacities as conflict resolver. I also want to be entrusted with enforcing and banning griefers. If needed, I would also be able and willing to assist Egypt in building the Leadership monument as silver pointed out in the earlier part of the debate.

Ninjas or Pirates? GO!

• Archipelago's Answer - Even though the movie Ninja Assassin set ninjas back 30 years, and despite eye patches being incredibly tough looking, I am still going to say ninjas. Here is why....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtR2m20C2YM

• Philadelphia's Answer -I would do them both.